Building A No BS Business That Gives You The Freedom And Lifestyle You Want - Interview With Lisa Greensill - Part 1
“I didn't really have any long term goals at that stage. I just had this ceiling and I didn't really know what was out there.
I think that was part of being in the course. You see there's all these opportunities and potential and possibilities.”
Lisa Greensill
I'm delighted to share an interview I did on my podcast recently, which was really a catch up with one of my favourite students, Lisa Greensill.
She's a brand and copy strategist and the co-creator of Brandover, a creative collaboration, based in Australia, focused on taking the bland out of financial brands.
She translates advisor and broker speak into client speak with an approach that focuses on purpose and personality to make businesses relatable, memorable and referral.
In 2022, Lisa was named Independent Financial Advisors Marketing Consultant Of The Year and Women In Finance Marketing Professional Of The Year.
I loved working with Lisa because she took action. She showed up and made things happen and her results reflect that effort.
And what I love about her story is not just that she's able to make more money in less time.
Yes, we all want that.
But even more importantly, it affected how she enjoys her life with her family.
I hadn't spoken to Lisa in almost a year except for an occasional email back and forth, so I was excited to do a catch-up with her as well.
There’s so much great stuff here, I’ve split this post into 2 parts.
This week, Lisa shares about how she went from charging hourly and struggling to find clients, to being fully booked out for months.
Next week, she shares some of the ups and downs she had, and how finding a great collaborative partner in her branding agency has made all the difference in how she delivers for her clients.
So, without further ado, here is Lisa Greensill.
PS: Lisa, I am so excited to have you on the show. Welcome.
LG: Well thanks, Pia. I'm so excited to be here.
PS: I wanted you to come on the show, first of all, because I miss seeing you, my friend on the other side of the world. And also because you had such a tremendous journey while we were working together and then you just continue to take off.
And I really just wanted to get the lowdown on what that really looked like. So if you don't mind, start by taking us back.
Take us back to when we started working together, almost two years ago.
So take me back to that time.
And do you remember how long you've been in business at that point?
LG: Well, I'd been freelancing for years, but just working off an hourly rate and very reactive to clients.
And then I went and did the StoryBrand certification and then I officially did the Lisa Greensill website, but I didn't have a model and I didn't know how to price things.
Because I've been freelancing, I've always just done, you know, between $50 and $80 an hour.
Literally that was where I was for all those years before joining your Program.
PS: Got it. And when you say freelancing, who were you freelancing for?
LG: In the financial planning industry here [Australia].
But to be honest, I really just had one major client, and then I just had a couple of little clients, there was just no way to scale.
And I felt like there was all this potential in me and I hadn't reached it.
But I couldn't quite put my finger on what it was. I just knew that there was more out there for me to do, like I had all this knowledge and I didn't really know.
And I'd had a business crush on you for years!
PS: I didn't know that!
LG: I followed you for years, and then your Program came up, and I had saved a bit of money, so I was like, ‘Okay, I'm going to jump on.’
It was the best decision I made because it’s literally what shaped how I now do business.
PS: I want to know a little bit more about what your business looked like at that point. Because it sounds like you had some steady work coming in.
You were working hourly, but what did that translate to in your day to day life?
LG: Well, interestingly enough, that big client shut - he sold his business.
So I literally had nothing when I came to your Program - I had zero clients.
So I had that one big client, he was about 20 hours a week and I have kids, so that was basically it.
And then he sold his business.
Because I'd done the StoryBrand Program, I'd started getting some sort of leads for that, and that, I think, is what led me to the [StoryBrand] Program in the first place is but I just didn't really know how to price it.
I just had no structure to what I was doing.
I was trying to price projects, but it was all hourly.
And I looked at what I priced that first project at - 6k or something - and now that same project would be 15k or so, probably even more.
Then I thought at the time ‘Oh my God, that's so much money. Six grand for one project? That's so much money.’
And that was still OK, but if you broke it down to an hourly rate, it probably wasn't incredible.
PS: And was that what you were doing?
Were you saying 6k, based on $50 or $80 an hour, times by the hours?
Is that how you came up with that?
LG: Yeah, basically.
PS: And then would you actually work those hours? Or would you end up working more hours?
LG: No, I would work more hours. Particularly the first few projects when you're trying to work out what you're doing.
And also what I hated was quoting.
Oh, that would take me so long, it was all over the shop.
I was just lucky that I had the StoryBrand thing.
That helped a bit because I kind of bought that reputation, I was paying for that.
I don't have that anymore. I've learnt the framework, so I don't need the certification.
PS: Oh, I didn't realise you actually paid to keep it up.
LG: Yes.
PS: OK. So basically you had this framework, that you had this way of working, that was helpful, but it was just one piece of the business.
You didn't know how the rest of the business should work.
You didn't like how long pitching and writing proposals took and you didn't know how to quote this stuff.
And it just seemed, and I'll put it in my words, unprofitable.
In your words, just taking way too long. Too much stuff.
And you’ve got other stuff to do. Because you’ve got kids, right?
LG: Yeah, I didn't even have a service agreement.
I was literally just flying by the seat of my pants, because I didn't really know where I was going.
But I was happy. I loved what I did.
PS: You loved what you did. And you had a lot of experience in it, and you're very good at it.
Okay. So you joined the Program, looking for some structure and to get some support.
What were you hoping to grow your business to be? What did you want out of it ultimately?
LG: Well, I wanted to love what I do and work with clients I love to work with.
And I wanted to earn a certain amount of money to, you know, pay for stuff to enhance our lifestyle.
I didn't really have any long term goals at that stage. I just had this ceiling and I didn't really know what was out there.
I think that was part of being in the course. You see there's all these opportunities and potential and possibilities.
And I didn't even realise they were there.
I'd kind of been in this kind of box.
I just wanted to feel like I was kind of in control, not that ‘flying by the seat of your pants’ kind of way.
And I also did want to build some more authority and…everything your course is about!
PS: So let's talk about when we worked together for almost a year, not quite a year.
So in that time, what did you end up changing in the way that you worked?
Give me some specifics that you shifted at the beginning.
LG: Lead Product would be the major one.
I remember I didn't quite get it right the first time.
Because when I came in, I had to leave for a little bit because it was all too much, but then I came back not too long after.
And in that time, I had tried to do the Lead Product on my own, and then when I came back and you had a look at it, I saw that what I was doing was more of a marketing plan.
And it hadn't clicked that what the brief is about is about getting people excited, giving them the strategy, really showing them your value.
So they don't even question the rest of it.
And so then when I came in, you helped me a lot to fix that Lead Product, and that was the major thing I did.
And I still do the Lead Product.
The other thing was just delivering the project, the Intensives.
And this is where, in the end, I couldn't stay on [The Program] and I had to try to work out on my own how to do the Intensives model.
So I kind of did a variation of it where I would break it up over three weeks.
And I'd have a ‘brand-over’ (because intensive is called a Brandover), and there would be a Brandover Day One etc.
But I didn't do the edits with them live, I would do a Magic Hour actually, there's so many things.
Sorry, I'm jumping about, but Magic Hour was a huge one.
Because every Brandover would start with some kind of positioning.
And it doesn't matter what it is, whether it's a logo or homepage copy, it doesn't matter how big or small.
I would always start with ‘What do we want to get out of today? Who are the clients that we're speaking to? What's the brand vibe and voice we're going for?’
So then by the time I got to the actual project stuff, they've got it right in their head.
I think this is genius because a lot of designers or copywriters just throw the copy or the design at people, and then I think the clients just haven't got it positioned…
PS: They just don't know how to make the decisions, and they don't know where to put it.
LG: So, I had one yesterday, and it was some homepage copy.
And he made one change, which was literally so small, and he had it approved in half an hour.
And most of my projects are like that. Even with an e-book that's 10 pages, someone will come back with, ‘Oh, no, my name is spelt wrong.’
It's amazing, having the Magic Hour, and breaking it up into the Intensive.
So even though I didn't do it exactly the same [as the Program] and I still don't have it exactly the same, I'm gonna get closer to it.
PS: I want you to give yourself some grace.
So Lisa, you were here with us for the first seven or eight months of this Program, right?
So it's been almost a full year since you left and then we moved the time, because your timezone just doesn't work with me and my people, right?
So I've really learned and grown to realise that everyone needs to do the Intensives in their own way.
For some people, it's going to be over three weeks or two weeks, or maybe it's going to be over the course of five days.
And it really doesn't matter.
What matters is that you take the principles of the Intensive and apply it in a way that works for you.
So I just want you to think of it like that, instead of ‘I'm gonna get it to that.’
Only change it more towards this model if that's helping you get towards your goal.
LG: Yeah, I mean, it’s better to have it as intensive as possible, because then you don't end up working on too many projects at once.
The good thing is how different it is to how most people work.
I just don't go back and forth with people.
So they know that this is what we're doing on this day, and then I'd say, ‘Keep the next half of the day free to do your changes, send them to me, I'll have it fixed up by tomorrow.’
And financial planners are a little different in that they have to get compliance approval.
And so it just depends on who you're working with.
So they have to go back to their compliance department, who has to approve it.
PS: And you're still doing the whole thing in three weeks, even with the compliance?
LG: It depends on the project.
For example, I've got one now where it can go over a couple of months because of the client’s longer lead time, but I still only work on the Intensive Days.
PS: Gotcha. So you might spread those Intensive days over but you're not bound to manage this project over months.
LG: No, no.
I just have it in my project management system, and I use ClickUp, and I’ll say ‘Okay, this Brandover Day’s here’ and I’ll Chunk and Stack my time for that project.
S, for example, you'll see in my calendar that this client’s here and here.
You know, it's not perfect yet, because I am still working on a couple of clients at once.
And this was a lot to do with the fact that I didn't have a ‘Steve’, so I was outsourcing graphic design.
But I found my ‘Steve’, she's an ‘Aynsley’.
It's amazing because it was the perfect timing.
Because over the course of the time that I was implementing, I really learnt a lot about what works and what doesn't work.
And so…what else?
I started the authority stuff, and I haven't even had time, but it's there.
I just started and I couldn't have won those awards without all of this stuff.
PS: Tell me how you won these awards if you haven't done any authority building.
LG: So I did. I did a few podcasts, and I've done a couple of webinars, and I've got a few more coming up.
PS: That's authority building!
LG: I know it's authority building, but here's so much more! I just realised the potential in it.
PS: Yeah, I mean, you haven't built your authority machine. But you've done a bunch of authority building and it has generated a bunch of clients for you.
LG: It really has, yeah, and all with the awards.
So, you get nominated - it's a self-nomination process, and people can nominate you as well.
And then you send your submission, it's quite extensive.
And a lot of the stuff you taught around the messaging and the niching, all of that comes into it.
Because it was really clear in my submission who I worked with, how I helped them and the transformation they went through.
And it was interesting because I can't really talk about results in terms of marketing stats, so that's why I thought I will I don't really have a chance here, but it was the intangible benefits that I think the judges liked because I had judges contact me after and say ‘I loved your amazing [submission]’.
PS: Really?
LG: Yeah. I guess it was a bit different for the industry here. I think when we're in the course you think that’s what everyone’s done, because everyone around you is doing it!
And we’re kind of in our bubble.
So I think it was really different for the financial industry here. And I just thought, ‘Well, how does one little person win an award like this?’
So I was literally…I didn't have speeches ready or anything. It was pretty funny!
So that’s where we’ll leave it this week.
I hope you got a ton of value from reading about Lisa’s journey so far, and we’ll pick it up again next week.
P.S. You can always jump on a call with my team if you want to learn all my tools and strategies to scale up your agency like Lisa - just go here to get started!